Blocking criteria proposal for F30+: Printing

[Stephen Gallagher]

There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.

I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.

I'd like to propose that we add the following criteria to Beta for Fedora 30+:
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)

and this to Final for Fedora 30+:
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
following drivers:
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).


[1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1628255
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[Vít Ondruch]

This one is interesting as well, since I was bitten by it:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1614978


V.

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).
[1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1628255
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[Petr Šabata]

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

Makes sense overall.

Perhaps we could compose a list of major CUPS drivers and make
sure we test each with at least one printer.

P

Post by Stephen Gallagher
[1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1628255

[Jared K. Smith]

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the

I'm in agreement here -- they seem like very reasonable criteria. As for
the printer drivers, I think that the Postscript ought to be in the list,
and perhaps something along the lines of HP LaserJet 4, as there are lots
and lots and lots of printers that try to stay compatible with that. I'd
also love to see "Print to PDF" added to that list, as I find myself using
that more and more as time goes on.

-Jared

[Ben Cotton]

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)

+1 to this

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

My main concern here is making sure QA has at least one of each of the
necessary printers. That could get large pretty quickly if we're not
careful. I'm also concerned that we could end up blocking the final
because a printer broke or is out of ink, or other hardware failure. I
think I'd rather keep the Beta proposal for Final. Since we have no
criterion currently, adding the Beta criterion is an improvement. We
can always make the requirement more aggressive if it turns out to be
insufficient.

--
Ben Cotton
Fedora Program Manager
TZ=America/Indiana/Indianapolis
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[Stephen Gallagher]

Post by Ben Cotton

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)

+1 to this

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

My main concern here is making sure QA has at least one of each of the
necessary printers. That could get large pretty quickly if we're not
careful. I'm also concerned that we could end up blocking the final
because a printer broke or is out of ink, or other hardware failure. I
think I'd rather keep the Beta proposal for Final. Since we have no
criterion currently, adding the Beta criterion is an improvement. We
can always make the requirement more aggressive if it turns out to be
insufficient.

We do in fact have criteria that we cannot always verify (like the
Serial-Attached SCSI criteria). In this case, we don't always test it,
but if someone who does have that hardware reports that it doesn't
work, we generally will block on it. So I'd suggest that this criteria
essentially means "We block if it is *known* to fail".
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[Chris Murphy]

Post by Stephen Gallagher

Post by Ben Cotton

Post by Stephen Gallagher
I'd like to propose that we add the following criteria to Beta for
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)

+1 to this

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

Print to file (PDF) is available by default and should be in the list.
" work" means
- creates a file that, when opened with the default PDF reader and in
Firefox using its built-in PDF support, is reasonably similar to
the preview shown on the GNOME print preview display.

As for a real printer, I suggest limiting it to an IPP Everywhere printer
(any make and model), also known as driverless printing.

Otherwise you can quickly get stuck in the mud.



So I'd suggest that this criteria

Post by Stephen Gallagher
essentially means "We block if it is *known* to fail".

+1

Chris Murphy

[Zdenek Dohnal]

Hi,

as CUPS maintainer, I agree with the idea of working printing as beta
criteria for Fedora.

I have two printers (Canon, HP) at my disposal, which I test cups,
cups-filters and hplip on when they have rebase. IMO it would be perfect
if such tests can be run every time when a component, which CUPS
requires, have an update - this way I could get know of glibc change or
nsswitch change sooner...

I can cover two printer driver software, hplip and foomatic-db+foomatic
with this testing (at least for these two printer models), but I would
need other printers for others (like gutenprint, foo2zjs, not mention
3rd party ones like brother, lexmark, epson) and especially a printer
which is capable of driver-less printing (like IPP everywhere standard,
or Airprint), which is the newest way how to install printers (I mean
most printers with release date after 2010). It would be great that we
can test it out too...

This way I would like to reach who they have such printers and asked
them for cooperation with testing - preferably on every cups update test
if printer works as it should.

According cups-pdf, which is different project and isn't under my
maintenance, I'm not sure, but I'm CCing cups-pdf maintainer, if he can
say more about it. The same can be said about ghostscript - it should be
tested properly too.

Post by Stephen Gallagher

On Thu, Sep 20, 2018 at 8:33 AM Stephen Gallagher

Post by Stephen Gallagher
I'd like to propose that we add the following criteria to Beta
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to

Fedora QA.

Post by Stephen Gallagher
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that

differences in

Post by Stephen Gallagher
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)

+1 to this

Post by Stephen Gallagher
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our

expected

Post by Stephen Gallagher
user base).

Print to file (PDF) is available by default and should be in the list. 
" work" means
- creates a file that, when opened with the default PDF reader and in
Firefox using its built-in PDF support, is reasonably similar to
the preview shown on the GNOME print preview display.
As for a real printer, I suggest limiting it to an IPP Everywhere
printer (any make and model), also known as driverless printing.
Otherwise you can quickly get stuck in the mud.
 So I'd suggest that this criteria
essentially means "We block if it is *known* to fail".
+1
Chris Murphy
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[Peter Robinson]

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

I'm against this as a blocker for a number of reasons:
* When we've tried to do hardware specific blocking at the time like
dual boot with MacOS this has not worked well and the dual boot is
testable with one piece of hardware
* It's easy to do a zero day update or a standard update to fix it
post release as doesn't affect the install path
* We don't do it for other non critical hardware selections such as
digital cameras, video cameras, and other such things
* Hardware availability, I don't see blocking for one type of printer
over another type is a good use of our time.
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[Chris Murphy]

Post by Peter Robinson

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

* When we've tried to do hardware specific blocking at the time like
dual boot with MacOS this has not worked well and the dual boot is
testable with one piece of hardware
* It's easy to do a zero day update or a standard update to fix it
post release as doesn't affect the install path
* We don't do it for other non critical hardware selections such as
digital cameras, video cameras, and other such things
* Hardware availability, I don't see blocking for one type of printer
over another type is a good use of our time.

I think it's reasonable to block on some really basic aspects of
printing breakage, like not being able to print to a PDF file, and
possibly being unable to print to the far simpler realm of IPP
Everywhere printers.

But model specific stuff. No way. I'd be generous with freeze
exceptions, but not blocking the release. I'm even on the fence if I'd
actually block on IPP Everywhere printing being broken. Once we're at
a blocker, do we have the resources to get it fixed within a few days?
If not, forget it. It can't be a blocker if we don't have the
resources to support fixing the blocker in a time escalated manner.


--
Chris Murphy
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[Zdenek Dohnal]

Post by Chris Murphy

Post by Peter Robinson

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

* When we've tried to do hardware specific blocking at the time like
dual boot with MacOS this has not worked well and the dual boot is
testable with one piece of hardware
* It's easy to do a zero day update or a standard update to fix it
post release as doesn't affect the install path
* We don't do it for other non critical hardware selections such as
digital cameras, video cameras, and other such things
* Hardware availability, I don't see blocking for one type of printer
over another type is a good use of our time.

I think it's reasonable to block on some really basic aspects of
printing breakage, like not being able to print to a PDF file, and
possibly being unable to print to the far simpler realm of IPP
Everywhere printers.
But model specific stuff. No way. I'd be generous with freeze
exceptions, but not blocking the release. I'm even on the fence if I'd
actually block on IPP Everywhere printing being broken. Once we're at
a blocker, do we have the resources to get it fixed within a few days?
If not, forget it. It can't be a blocker if we don't have the
resources to support fixing the blocker in a time escalated manner.

IMHO for the specific stuff (main printer drivers packages - hplip,
foomatic+foomatic-db, gutenprint) we could do a test of general
functionality - like if there is at least one printer which works with
ppd from the package, then package seems to okay to go.

[Adam Williamson]

Post by Stephen Gallagher
There was a bug[1] filed recently that indicated that printing was
broken on certain printers. As a result of that discussion, it became
apparent that there was no criteria for printing to work at all, which
seems like an oversight.
I discussed this briefly with Matthias Clasen this morning and he
agreed that this should be treated as blocking for Workstation.
* Printing must work on at least one printer available to Fedora QA.
"Work" is defined as the output from the device matching a preview
shown on the GNOME print preview display. (Note that differences in
color reproduction are not considered "non-working".)
* Printing must work on at least one printer using each of the
(I don't know which ones to specify here, but we ought to try to
figure out a cross-section that covers a large swath of our expected
user base).

So as with the optical media proposal we had quite a lively discussion
on this one, then it got stuck a bit. Stephen, can you take a look at
all the followups and either restate or revise the proposal? Thanks!
--
Adam Williamson
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net
http://www.happyassassin.net
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